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Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5718

Cold nosed

I sincerely hope that every hunter will have at least 1 experience in their hunting lifetime to witness a true cold nosed dog. One that runs not wallows a track, but runs a track that known good dogs can not smell. A dog that opens their eyes to a true cold nosed dog. I have been fortunate to own a few, not many that could do this and they were fun to hunt. I would really love to own one more before my hunting days are over. Dave

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08-09-2024 09:48 PM

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Georgeb
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2021
Location: Tenn.
Posts: 258

Ive owned one hound in 50 + years that was a cold trailing tree the coon dog.And shed burn up a hot track too.You could tell by her mouth what she was doing.Long bawl on the coldest,short bawl when getting it heated up and fast chop on the hot track.I have some blue hounds now that are as good of track dogs as ive hunted with and dont have to have a hot track to tree the coon but they are not like her.I wouldnt trade my hounds I have now for her back tho.When you turned her loose she treed some where.No reverse.I cant hunt a dog like her anymore.

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08-10-2024 03:05 PM

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Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5718

Cold nosed

quote:
Originally posted by Georgeb
Ive owned one hound in 50 + years that was a cold trailing tree the coon dog.And shed burn up a hot track too.You could tell by her mouth what she was doing.Long bawl on the coldest,short bawl when getting it heated up and fast chop on the hot track.I have some blue hounds now that are as good of track dogs as ive hunted with and dont have to have a hot track to tree the coon but they are not like her.I wouldnt trade my hounds I have now for her back tho.When you turned her loose she treed some where.No reverse.I cant hunt a dog like her anymore.

George, Sounds like you had a dog that I described. One that could run and tree a coon that others dogs did not know existed. Other than hunting to wide she was my kind of dog. I hunt mountains and thinner coon populations and I love that type of dog. Having such a dog often meant treeing a coon or coming up empty. I always wanted to tree a coon. Dave

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08-11-2024 03:16 AM

novicane65
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2013
Location: Nichols Ny
Posts: 1566

There's cold nose and too dumb to use it. And then there's cold nose with the brains to be able to "RUN" on tracks that others can't begin to smell. Seems to me 90% of hunters haven't seen an Elite style track dog, and I personally think 80-90% haven't hunted with an Elite type of dog. And I also think there's elite dogs that are different types of elite. Some are elite in 1 category but are avg in another.

There's below avg dogs, avg dogs, above avg dogs, and elite dogs. Most hunters, pleasure or local competition hunters that haven't even hunted with above avg dogs let alone the elite dogs. And I can honestly say I've only hunted with a few that I feel were close to being above avg to elite total packages. These dogs are the few and far between types that are once in a lifetime hounds.

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08-18-2024 08:44 PM

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Georgeb
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Registered: Jul 2021
Location: Tenn.
Posts: 258

Re: Cold nosed

quote:
Originally posted by Dave Richards
George, Sounds like you had a dog that I described. One that could run and tree a coon that others dogs did not know existed. Other than hunting to wide she was my kind of dog. I hunt mountains and thinner coon populations and I love that type of dog. Having such a dog often meant treeing a coon or coming up empty. I always wanted to tree a coon. Dave

I had her before id wised up to tone breaking.I did have a good ATS beep beep tracker tho and could keep up with her and find her treed.I think how much more of a pleasure to hunt shed been if shed been tone broke but back then i didnt want my dog coming back but being tone broke would have been nice.I have to have and enjoy a good handling hound now and my blue hounds are that.Although they do get deep on me sometimes if i aint careful.I hunt by myself most the time and ussually only hunt one hound at a time.

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08-19-2024 01:45 AM

Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5718

Cold nosed

quote:
Originally posted by novicane65
There's cold nose and too dumb to use it. And then there's cold nose with the brains to be able to "RUN" on tracks that others can't begin to smell. Seems to me 90% of hunters haven't seen an Elite style track dog, and I personally think 80-90% haven't hunted with an Elite type of dog. And I also think there's elite dogs that are different types of elite. Some are elite in 1 category but are avg in another.

There's below avg dogs, avg dogs, above avg dogs, and elite dogs. Most hunters, pleasure or local competition hunters that haven't even hunted with above avg dogs let alone the elite dogs. And I can honestly say I've only hunted with a few that I feel were close to being above avg to elite total packages. These dogs are the few and far between types that are once in a lifetime hounds.

Eric, I agree 100 percent with your post. Most hunters have not and will not ever see or hunt with an elite dog. I have coon hunted for over 60 years and feel very blessed to have had the privilege to hunt with 3 dogs in the elite class. Only problem with that is nothing else will ever suit you. You may enjoy other dogs, but you know better exists somewhere and are always looking for that elite dog. Dave

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08-20-2024 12:45 AM

2ol2hunt
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: north ala.
Posts: 915

These dogs yall are calling elite did they have any faults or did you consider them to be a perfect hound?

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08-23-2024 06:55 PM

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Josh Michaelis
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2004
Location: North MO
Posts: 2352

quote:
Originally posted by DL NH
All I can say about this comment is if you really believe this you�ve never owned a truly cold nosed hound or seen one in action. I�m not talking about a track straddler that many think is a cold nosed dog which often actually turns out to be at best a medium nosed dog that can�t move a track.

Ask the successful big game hound men & some women that hunt mountain lions and bobcat on snow in the sub zero temps and dry powder snow. I�ve heard this �all dogs can smell the same� for years and it�s just plain false.

I�ve owned and hunted hounds for over 40 years and I know better than to think that all hounds can smell the same. It�s not true.

There are multiple studies that say otherwise.

Think of it this way. Two people have 20/20 vision, but one of them can read faster than the other. The sense is the same. How quickly they can interpret the information that sense is bringing them differs.

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08-24-2024 05:03 AM

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shadinc
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3417

I don't understand how some think they know what a dog is smelling as opposed to him having the desire to work a cold track. I understand you saying you've seen dogs trail when others wouldn't but how do you know the other dog couldn't smell it. In controlled conditions scientist have concluded that all dogs have pretty much the same scenting ability. When you're breeding for cold trailing dogs how do you know you're getting more nose or more desire to cold trail? These hard running "hot nosed" competition dogs are looking for a coon and not a coon track.

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08-24-2024 05:23 PM

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Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5718

Cold nosed

quote:
Originally posted by shadinc
I don't understand how some think they know what a dog is smelling as opposed to him having the desire to work a cold track. I understand you saying you've seen dogs trail when others wouldn't but how do you know the other dog couldn't smell it. In controlled conditions scientist have concluded that all dogs have pretty much the same scenting ability. When you're breeding for cold trailing dogs how do you know you're getting more nose or more desire to cold trail? These hard running "hot nosed" competition dogs are looking for a coon and not a coon track.

Donald, I respect what you are saying, but I definitely disagree with anyone saying that all dogs can smell the same. My experience has proved this statement to be false. Real life situations are much more accurate that so called tests that all dogs can smell the same. The analogy of folks with 20/20 vision that can see different is true only in that game vision or seeing things others can not is based on experience, not ability. I agree that dogs have different experiences as well and that could make a difference in how they work a colder track. My analogy is different humans have different abilities regarding smell, eye sight, etc. and so do dogs. Their abilities factor in to enable them to do different things, without these abilities they simple can not do the things that those with these abilities can do. We see this all the time with humans in sports and other activities. Dogs are the same, some are smarter, some can SMELL better, etc. Dave

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08-24-2024 06:12 PM

Ridgerunner1988
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Registered: May 2020
Location:
Posts: 342

I believe all hounds have the same amount of nose but it's the desire they have to run what they smell is what makes the dog better. A true coonhound has the desire to get out there and tree a coon not just be out there to be out here after anything they smell. This all comes from John Wick and I agree with him on this. Because if you take a plate of food outside do the pups not all come to the scent of the food. Whether or not the hound wants to tree coon or not is the question for me. And that where the breeding and training comes into play.

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08-27-2024 01:15 AM

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Ridgerunner1988
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08-27-2024 01:15 AM

Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 1950

Re: Mr Donald--

quote:
Originally posted by OLD TIMER
I know that there are hounds that have a better nose than others.

But I also think that some are trained so they don't learn how to use their nose was the point I was trying to make.

Say like a 20 something young lady that thinks shes as good as Ms Clark in basketball--They have all the same equipment, heck they may even look like twins, but there's just that something Ms Clark has that makes her better at "her game." The same is true in hounds, they all have the same equipment, but some are better at their game. And training can get them better and maybe to their best of their abilty--but some just have that special something. The night I seen that first hand was when my young Mikie took a track out across an iced over harvest corn field and Cheta II couldn't run with him. Now Cheta had a heck of a nose and I seen her open and move a track while the other 3 in the cast didn't know a coon had been there. After a 1/4 mile they finally joined in and they did tree it. Mikie was young and I was thinking that maybe this didn't have a ringtail. But when he located and started counting them off, that was the night that proved to me that they all can not smell the track the same.

I'll have to say I agree on what you said about some dogs are trained to run hot tracks while others take them as they come�

I sometimes hunt with a friend that has some of the same dogs I hunt because I've given him pups�the reason why I don't hunt with him much is because his hunting style is nothing like mine�he hunts how he wants with minimal consideration for his dogs�we as hog hunters cast, rig or road the dogs�his style doesn't take the wind into consideration�he doesn't pay attention to his dogs when roading and sometimes moves too fast which doesn't allow his dogs much time to be thorough when hunting�so his dogs are more interested in keeping up than working a colder track when roading�because of his style I stay back on my 4 wheeler and watch his dogs up ahead�if its a hot track they will take it, if not a hot track they will leave it and follow my friend�my dogs will take all the tracks they can handle�because when they act like a hog is around I stop and let them work it out�sometimes they give it a try but will be back if they cannot line it out�but many times they can work out what his dogs won�t even attempt to start�same thing with winding�mine will wind and go to hogs when his wont even react to the wind currents unless the smell is strong�some of my dogs have outstanding winding ability�I watch my dogs very close and make sure they are given the opportunity to work to the best of their abilities�sometimes I stop and get off the Wheeler and maneuver into position for the dogs to better work the wind if I can't do it with the Wheeler�its all about training the dogs to use their nose and hunting ability to their highest potential�
I strongly believe his dogs lack of nose is more because of hunting style and not the nose�
In my friends defense he works for someone and he also has a side business that keeps him busy�so he tends to be in a hurry to work a hunt into a busy schedule�

Back around 1983, a college professor in Tennessee or Mississippi came up with a solution that he said a dog could not resist�that they would react to the smell�
He tested many pups under a week old and various other ages of pups�it worked so well he was going to put in for a Patent�his testing included bloodhounds which tested the same as all the other breeds�but only one breed consistently had a better nose at this young age�I�m pretty sure it was the English Pointer�

Whether dogs have the same nose power or not I cannot say one way or the other�but I do believe the trigger switches to engage a response to what they smell is different from each other even if it's the same breed or bloodline�

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